Post by The Aquarian on Jul 17, 2005 12:22:47 GMT -8
lol
It's a bit amusing that a person can become so passionate about something that is completely unreal, but I have to say it -- the Daughters of Cacophony are not a Toreador or Malkavian bloodline. This has been the source of more than my fair share of rants at LARP (not this one), and Live Journal entries. Given what I am playing now, I'm going to continuel my wonky crusade to pursuade everyone to my viewpoint
So if the DoC don't come from either the Toreador or Malkavians, where DO they come from? Ventrue!! ;D
Here's why:
How are the Daughters of Cacophony a Ventrue Bloodline? The better question to ask is how are they NOT? The most obvious answers are that they are all singers -- thus artist, thus have quite a bit in common with clan Toreador, and that they have the ability to cause madness with their songs thus seeming to make them more like the Malkavians. These are answers people give when they have not truly saught deeper understanding of these characteristics. In fact, BOTH of these things can be used to justify their existance as Ventrue.
First, we must look at the bloodline's internal structure. They are EXTREMELY selective, and refuse to embrace ANYONE who is not a singer. In 1997 they became even more exclusive by purging all MALE Daughters of Cacophony from their population. Furthermore, a person will not be accepted into the bloodline simply because they are a singer. No... they have to be GREAT. They have to shine among all the rest. They have to be an embodyment of their song. Now, we must compare to the Ventrue. Their embrace practices are almost as selective. They want the best of the best. Anything less is wasted vitae. Furthermore, the Ventrue have a mental/physiological WEAKNESS which compells them ONLY to feed from one kind of person. Even if they are dying of first, they WILL NOT feed from someone who is not of their chosen ilk. The the Daughters of Cacophony are reminiscent of this exclusivity in their refusal to tolerate any non singers. Is it not possible that the bloodline's progenitor was not in fact a Ventrue who believed so much in her convictions and love for singers and song, that she created an entire bloodline for it? We must remember even outside of Mage belief is POWER in the world of darkness. This IS how new bloodlines are created in Vampire.
All bloodlines come from somewhere, and most aren't created when a new person is embraced. Instead, an existing vampire is transformed. In the case of the Kiasyd, there was a Lasombra just like any other Lasombra (physiologically speaking) who started mucking around with fae blood in experiments, and... I believe there might have been a bit of true magick involved. The point is, however a Lasombra became something else and continued to further evolve even after becoming a distinctly new bloodline. This is apparent when we consider that the Kiasyd of the Dark Ages practiced Potence, Obtenebration, and Mytherceria and the ones of modern day practice Dominate, Obtenebration, and Mytherceria. In the case of Samedi, we have an evolved form of the Cappidocians, which have channeled their sorcery into a quasi-physical discipline (Thanatosis) and their clan weakness shifted to reflect the decaying quality of their signature discipline. The Harbingers of SKulls too decend from the Cappidocians. While many say that they are Cappies, this is not necessarily the case. The shadowlands warped them. Although they still practice sorcery like they once did, all their newly embraced childer will have the appearance of a mummified corpse, rather than the mere deathly palor of their ancestors. In the case of Gargoyles, we have a situation where the Tremere essencially mealted two vampires together to make a new creation devoid of it's memory but still embodying physical characteristics of the parrent clans. If we look at Tremere (and yes they ARE a bloodline, I don't care what their snooty regents say) we realize that they are basically just Tzimisce that have transcended their clan weakness and replaced it with a bit of "Respect mah authoritah!" There's a reason why the clans hate each other so much. They have two common disciplines with the Old Clan Tzimisce (Auspex and Dominate), and practice Sorcery (Thaumaturgy). In the case of either Brujah or True Brujah (I'll use TB as the bloodline for simplicity's sake) we see how there are two disciplines shared with the parrent clan, a warped form of the clan weakness (actually inverse in this case), and a modification of the parrent clan's discipline.
That being said, we must consider the bloodline's physiological traits. Their clan disciplines are Melpominee, Presence, and Fortitude. The clan disciplines of Ventrue are Presence, Dominate, and Fortitude. The Daughters of Cacophony share TWO disciplines with the Ventrue. Meanwhile they only have one in common with the Toreador (Presence), and NONE in common with the Malkavians. Like all the above bloodline examples, there are two shared in clan disciplines with the parent clan, and one new one. With the exception of the exception of the Kiasyd's Mytherceria, ALL of the above bloodlines have two disciplines in common with the root clans, and a modification of the root clan's parrent discipline. In the case of Gargoyles we have Potence (present in Nosferatu), Fortitude (present in Gangrel and Ravnos -- although there are no documented cases of a Ravnos becoming a Gargoyle, the ritual simply requires that the vamprie in question has animalism in clan), Viskeratika (a modication to all of the present clan's shape shifting powers, or in the nosferateu's case change in body shape), and Flight (a simplified version of thaumaturgy, or more likely Kuldonic Sorcery).
Okay, so where did Melpominee come from? That sounds alot like Dementation. After all, after level three you are mucking with people's minds through the power of song. Tisk tisk. The Ventrue practice Dominate -- the discipline of mind control. In fact, even the Malkavians practiced Dominate for centuries, prior to somewhere between 1996 and 1999. Considering the other two common disciplines with Clan Ventrue, it seems far more likely to me that Melpominee is an warped incarnation of Dominate as opposed Dementation. All three disciplines have the power to alter minds, however Melpominee has another disctintly unique commonality with Dominate that is not present in Dementation -- the necessity for spoken word to be effective. With the exception of Level 5 Dominate, ALL applications of the power require the character to use spoken word to be effective. Meanwhile Dementation requires none. Melpominee by contrast required spoken or sung word for all levels prior to 6, at which point all that is required is a loud screetch.
Now, even if I have convinced people that it might be possible that the bloodline might in some way be related to the Ventrue, there's still a bit of doubt in people's minds. Why isn't this well known? Ventrue are ANAL about their lineage. They have got to know! Right?
Possibly right, also possibly wrong. First off we have to consider that no one knows who spawned the bloodline, or at least if someone does know they aren't talking. How can this be? Well, remember that the Ventrue are adept users of Dominate, and the first Daughter of Cacophony would likely be of the 6th generation as there are no known Daughters lower than seventh. Given the 'holes' in the bloodline's origins, it seems reasonable to suggest that extensive uses of Dominate have played a role in this coverup.
Furthermore, we have to consider why it is that the founder would want to hide herself. Afterall, she's created a bloodline of great prestuige -- IDOLIZED by the Toreador. Not really hated by anyone... or so it seems. Is it not strange that the one bloodline that does not seem to have blood enemies with someone else in the World of Darkness has the most reclusive progenitor of them all? It just doesn't make sense.
If, however, we consider Ventrue culture prior to the past 30 or 40 years, we realize that the clan has been a patriarchy. The Blue Bloods have been ruled and guided by men for centuries, and while women were occasionally embraced, they did not assume positions of power within the clan. This is largely true of the times (especially the Dark Ages) in general, but it was ESPECIALLY true of of Clan Ventrue. They have, afterall, always prided themselves for being the upper crust of society -- revolution isn't exactly valued within their clan culture and the fact of the matter is in decades and centuries past women did not commonly assume great power. There is a reason why the term "Old Boys Club" is often used in conjunction with the clan. They are not going to take kindly (especially elders), to being pubically associated with either a feminist (as it once was), or a female supremecist (as it is now) bloodline.
Next we must consider another aspect of Ventrue culture -- lineage is like gold. There are VERY few clans the keep track of their heritage as meticulously as the Ventrue. Their Blood is Blue. They are proud. They are greatness. They are not going to let their prescious gene pool be muddied by some upity woman with a music fetish. From a common Ventrue perspective, it's a disgrace to the clan. To think that someone would have the audacity to forsake her noble line to form a cult of wayward performers! It's virtual blasphemy! What's more, if such became public knowledge, it would reveal that the clan was not capable of controling it's members. While others may not care about this as much, the Ventrue live, breathe, and drink social control. There isn't much that could be a greater slap in the face than perhaps being kicked out of the Camarilla for some odd reason.
Does the Daughter of Cacophony founder have a reason to hide herself if she was embraced Ventrue? You better believe it. She may as well be the antichrist. It's likely that most Ventrue would have no clue as to any of this informatiton, meanwhile elders have a very legitamate reason to keep it secret -- it undermines their authority. It shows that it is possible to escape their web of influence and these ideas potentially spreading through the neonate population are more dangerous than the origional defector herself.
*breathe breathe, gasp gasp*
I rest my case.
It's a bit amusing that a person can become so passionate about something that is completely unreal, but I have to say it -- the Daughters of Cacophony are not a Toreador or Malkavian bloodline. This has been the source of more than my fair share of rants at LARP (not this one), and Live Journal entries. Given what I am playing now, I'm going to continuel my wonky crusade to pursuade everyone to my viewpoint
So if the DoC don't come from either the Toreador or Malkavians, where DO they come from? Ventrue!! ;D
Here's why:
How are the Daughters of Cacophony a Ventrue Bloodline? The better question to ask is how are they NOT? The most obvious answers are that they are all singers -- thus artist, thus have quite a bit in common with clan Toreador, and that they have the ability to cause madness with their songs thus seeming to make them more like the Malkavians. These are answers people give when they have not truly saught deeper understanding of these characteristics. In fact, BOTH of these things can be used to justify their existance as Ventrue.
First, we must look at the bloodline's internal structure. They are EXTREMELY selective, and refuse to embrace ANYONE who is not a singer. In 1997 they became even more exclusive by purging all MALE Daughters of Cacophony from their population. Furthermore, a person will not be accepted into the bloodline simply because they are a singer. No... they have to be GREAT. They have to shine among all the rest. They have to be an embodyment of their song. Now, we must compare to the Ventrue. Their embrace practices are almost as selective. They want the best of the best. Anything less is wasted vitae. Furthermore, the Ventrue have a mental/physiological WEAKNESS which compells them ONLY to feed from one kind of person. Even if they are dying of first, they WILL NOT feed from someone who is not of their chosen ilk. The the Daughters of Cacophony are reminiscent of this exclusivity in their refusal to tolerate any non singers. Is it not possible that the bloodline's progenitor was not in fact a Ventrue who believed so much in her convictions and love for singers and song, that she created an entire bloodline for it? We must remember even outside of Mage belief is POWER in the world of darkness. This IS how new bloodlines are created in Vampire.
All bloodlines come from somewhere, and most aren't created when a new person is embraced. Instead, an existing vampire is transformed. In the case of the Kiasyd, there was a Lasombra just like any other Lasombra (physiologically speaking) who started mucking around with fae blood in experiments, and... I believe there might have been a bit of true magick involved. The point is, however a Lasombra became something else and continued to further evolve even after becoming a distinctly new bloodline. This is apparent when we consider that the Kiasyd of the Dark Ages practiced Potence, Obtenebration, and Mytherceria and the ones of modern day practice Dominate, Obtenebration, and Mytherceria. In the case of Samedi, we have an evolved form of the Cappidocians, which have channeled their sorcery into a quasi-physical discipline (Thanatosis) and their clan weakness shifted to reflect the decaying quality of their signature discipline. The Harbingers of SKulls too decend from the Cappidocians. While many say that they are Cappies, this is not necessarily the case. The shadowlands warped them. Although they still practice sorcery like they once did, all their newly embraced childer will have the appearance of a mummified corpse, rather than the mere deathly palor of their ancestors. In the case of Gargoyles, we have a situation where the Tremere essencially mealted two vampires together to make a new creation devoid of it's memory but still embodying physical characteristics of the parrent clans. If we look at Tremere (and yes they ARE a bloodline, I don't care what their snooty regents say) we realize that they are basically just Tzimisce that have transcended their clan weakness and replaced it with a bit of "Respect mah authoritah!" There's a reason why the clans hate each other so much. They have two common disciplines with the Old Clan Tzimisce (Auspex and Dominate), and practice Sorcery (Thaumaturgy). In the case of either Brujah or True Brujah (I'll use TB as the bloodline for simplicity's sake) we see how there are two disciplines shared with the parrent clan, a warped form of the clan weakness (actually inverse in this case), and a modification of the parrent clan's discipline.
That being said, we must consider the bloodline's physiological traits. Their clan disciplines are Melpominee, Presence, and Fortitude. The clan disciplines of Ventrue are Presence, Dominate, and Fortitude. The Daughters of Cacophony share TWO disciplines with the Ventrue. Meanwhile they only have one in common with the Toreador (Presence), and NONE in common with the Malkavians. Like all the above bloodline examples, there are two shared in clan disciplines with the parent clan, and one new one. With the exception of the exception of the Kiasyd's Mytherceria, ALL of the above bloodlines have two disciplines in common with the root clans, and a modification of the root clan's parrent discipline. In the case of Gargoyles we have Potence (present in Nosferatu), Fortitude (present in Gangrel and Ravnos -- although there are no documented cases of a Ravnos becoming a Gargoyle, the ritual simply requires that the vamprie in question has animalism in clan), Viskeratika (a modication to all of the present clan's shape shifting powers, or in the nosferateu's case change in body shape), and Flight (a simplified version of thaumaturgy, or more likely Kuldonic Sorcery).
Okay, so where did Melpominee come from? That sounds alot like Dementation. After all, after level three you are mucking with people's minds through the power of song. Tisk tisk. The Ventrue practice Dominate -- the discipline of mind control. In fact, even the Malkavians practiced Dominate for centuries, prior to somewhere between 1996 and 1999. Considering the other two common disciplines with Clan Ventrue, it seems far more likely to me that Melpominee is an warped incarnation of Dominate as opposed Dementation. All three disciplines have the power to alter minds, however Melpominee has another disctintly unique commonality with Dominate that is not present in Dementation -- the necessity for spoken word to be effective. With the exception of Level 5 Dominate, ALL applications of the power require the character to use spoken word to be effective. Meanwhile Dementation requires none. Melpominee by contrast required spoken or sung word for all levels prior to 6, at which point all that is required is a loud screetch.
Now, even if I have convinced people that it might be possible that the bloodline might in some way be related to the Ventrue, there's still a bit of doubt in people's minds. Why isn't this well known? Ventrue are ANAL about their lineage. They have got to know! Right?
Possibly right, also possibly wrong. First off we have to consider that no one knows who spawned the bloodline, or at least if someone does know they aren't talking. How can this be? Well, remember that the Ventrue are adept users of Dominate, and the first Daughter of Cacophony would likely be of the 6th generation as there are no known Daughters lower than seventh. Given the 'holes' in the bloodline's origins, it seems reasonable to suggest that extensive uses of Dominate have played a role in this coverup.
Furthermore, we have to consider why it is that the founder would want to hide herself. Afterall, she's created a bloodline of great prestuige -- IDOLIZED by the Toreador. Not really hated by anyone... or so it seems. Is it not strange that the one bloodline that does not seem to have blood enemies with someone else in the World of Darkness has the most reclusive progenitor of them all? It just doesn't make sense.
If, however, we consider Ventrue culture prior to the past 30 or 40 years, we realize that the clan has been a patriarchy. The Blue Bloods have been ruled and guided by men for centuries, and while women were occasionally embraced, they did not assume positions of power within the clan. This is largely true of the times (especially the Dark Ages) in general, but it was ESPECIALLY true of of Clan Ventrue. They have, afterall, always prided themselves for being the upper crust of society -- revolution isn't exactly valued within their clan culture and the fact of the matter is in decades and centuries past women did not commonly assume great power. There is a reason why the term "Old Boys Club" is often used in conjunction with the clan. They are not going to take kindly (especially elders), to being pubically associated with either a feminist (as it once was), or a female supremecist (as it is now) bloodline.
Next we must consider another aspect of Ventrue culture -- lineage is like gold. There are VERY few clans the keep track of their heritage as meticulously as the Ventrue. Their Blood is Blue. They are proud. They are greatness. They are not going to let their prescious gene pool be muddied by some upity woman with a music fetish. From a common Ventrue perspective, it's a disgrace to the clan. To think that someone would have the audacity to forsake her noble line to form a cult of wayward performers! It's virtual blasphemy! What's more, if such became public knowledge, it would reveal that the clan was not capable of controling it's members. While others may not care about this as much, the Ventrue live, breathe, and drink social control. There isn't much that could be a greater slap in the face than perhaps being kicked out of the Camarilla for some odd reason.
Does the Daughter of Cacophony founder have a reason to hide herself if she was embraced Ventrue? You better believe it. She may as well be the antichrist. It's likely that most Ventrue would have no clue as to any of this informatiton, meanwhile elders have a very legitamate reason to keep it secret -- it undermines their authority. It shows that it is possible to escape their web of influence and these ideas potentially spreading through the neonate population are more dangerous than the origional defector herself.
*breathe breathe, gasp gasp*
I rest my case.
Which again is why the bloodline is so small and exclusive. They need to find people before they explode into superfame that have all the makings of truly wonderful legendary singers before they have been polished. 
Perhaps I shall make an e-book of my own. 
