was it hide the tears, or the smiles?

[Nate]

Dear ECC,

Congratulations. You've won again, with yet another character death. I hope that you're proud. I hope that you savor the win.

I hope that, just for one second, that you take a good look at your characters, every ounce of energy and time and effort that went into it. And then I hope that you can imagine it commit suicide. Then you might begin to understand why I'm so frustrated.

Since I started playing here, I've burnt through eight characters. I've written each story for these characters as beautifully as I could. I crafted them as carefully as I could. Each time, I struggled, alone, to carve out a niche in the game, fighting tooth and claw to be a part of something bigger than myself, and simply being kept apart by the rest of the players. So of course they suicided, one way or another. Wouldn't you?

The thing that frustrates me the most is that any one of you could have saved their lives, by simply holding out a hand, showing me the ropes, giving me a task. Anything. And at anytime, I could have crawled out of my shell, if I knew which way to go.

Instead, you keep to your cliques, people you know, and fuck the rest of the world. Fine, you don't like change, I can appreciate that. After all, I've been going to the same empty bed for the last thirty years, and that'll never change. I've never had a human connection that I could feel, and I never will.

And I'll write another character, and put all my soul into it again. I'll leave myself open, and get my heart broken even more. Because I can't change any more than any of you. Maybe someday soon, I won't be able to feel anything.

[Audrey]

I suspect this is gonna go poorly or not at all, so one thought before I bail on this subject. Have you considered the possibility that you will not like the suggestions people might have, to help you create a character with a better chance of 'fitting in', as it were? I suspect their characters have no more reason to go out of their way to help you than yours have to suddenly act differently. It seems you want someone to point you in the right direction, but it seems you don't hear the underlying directions in the behavior and words of others. True, people could be more direct. I suspect you have no interest in my specific suggestions, but I figured it was worth adding that idea. And now, I'm going to bail the hell out, in case this gets nasty. I may be paranoid, but my ass remains in one piece, and I like it that way.

[Magic Rob]

Alright Captain Visqueen, lets get a few things straight.

1) You have a place in this community. People know your actual name far more then any of your character names. That's a major win right there that you can't really appreciate.

2) Your burning through characters because of their dumb decisions cannot be held against the rest of us.

3) Some of us in the community had high hopes for your last toon before you decided to get super mouthy and belligerent. Which would have been fine, you were winning support, until you blatantly started breaking rules and going against orders.

4) This character died BECAUSE YOU WALKED THE SPIRAL. Turns out that's pretty much a death sentence. Not to mention the LAUNDRY list of shit your corpse told us that you were doing. Breaking the veil, telling the enemy our defenses, telling them our plans... Really, guy?

5) All the backstory in the world won't save you anything if you don't apply it IC. So here is my suggestion to you. Get with one or two people at game. You know their names, you've RPed with em, just saunter on up and say "Hey, so, I was curious about something. I am writing this history, would you like to be in it?" Ever consider that approach? People LOVE hearing about their own characters, and hearing about them from someone else's point of view is just the best. I promise you'll get one or two character ties with that approach. Then you won't have that same tired loner thing going on.

And my final bit of advise, once you're in play: STOP PLAYING THE LONER TYPE. You think we thrust it on you, but we don't. Your pack kept coming to me with 'he wandered off again!' stories like every other week. If you want to be part of something, you need to help build something.

-Rob.

[Athena Fire-in-Snow]

Nate - I sent you a PM, go read it please?

[Nate]

I'm not sure why I feel the need to defend a dead man, but here I am. For what its worth, this is the last thing that I'll say on the matter.

1) Valid, legit, and true. I've been working on that human connection that I seem to be missing for more than a decade. I'm still working on it. Thanks for reminding me.

2) Dumb decisions, in as near chronological order as I can remember. Jacob, ghoul, retired for Ivan the Nosferatu. Who in turn was retired so I could come down to werewolf. Tony the Glasswalker, my first attempt at a werewolf character. Suicided attempting to leave a war pack. Billy the Virtual Adept, retired as it took entirely too much caffeine to get into that character. Noson the blind Bonegnawer, taken out like a punk when traveling through the Dreaming with his pack, trying to rescue a lost pack mate. Vincent the Boggan, the first one eaten by a dragon in the Dreaming. Never saw that one coming. Andre the Euthanatos spiraled quickly out of control, as most psychos do without someone to slam on the brakes. Convinced to suicide. Which brings me to Lies, who was shoved down the spiral when he (and I agree with you, this was foolish) attempted to start a shadow game.

3) A mouthy Galliard, you say? And became belligerent when not only the few people that had listened to him not take the warnings seriously, but he is told to his face by the leader of the group that they know how the story ends. It ends with Lies captured and tortured. I would have lost the character then if I hadn't convinced a few people to form a pack. And as for not following orders, when a ST pulls you to the side and says "sometime during the week. . ." how can you argue? I'd have to eventually go back to the area, to reclaim my belongings if nothing else. Am I supposed to say "sorry bub, I don't want to do a damn thing, and I'd rather sit here like a lump of fur."

4) Again, shoved, but the end results are the same. The traps that I set up wouldn't have broken anything as long as the other characters acted smartly. I only told the BSDs the same holes in the defenses that I pointed out to Wilhelm, which was, in turn, promptly ignored. And how I was the only thing that set off Lew's alarm is beyond me.

5) We are in agreement on most parts here. I'm not sure if I mentioned the fact that I was diagnosed as a social-phobe, medicated because of that for awhile. I'm not very good at small talk, let alone everyday conversation. Collaborative work, while a good idea, is still a new concept to me. I will give it a try once I get my head back on straight.

And the finale. I put together a Shadowlord Galliard in the attempt to change my behavior and head space. And I fully recognize that it takes two to tango. As for wandering off, I smoke. Tough. Also, one needs to do thing to gain renown, and therefor rank. My attempts to get the pack to do things ended in ridicule or refusal. If I don't catch up with the rest of you, I feel that I'll just keep being left behind.

Thank you for your constructive criticism. I would have preferred to have this debate face to face, but I suppose that rants fit the scheme well enough.

I'm going to do my best to forget this character's story, and I honestly hope that I haven't stepped on too many toes in this latest failed social experiment.

[Josh]

Alright Nate,

So I want to say first off that I am not a kind person. I generally have little concern for folk that are my people.

With that in mind, I would like to earnestly assist you. I have watched the troubles and trials that you have gone through for the past couple of years.

I am going to address some of your points, others are outside my desire or willingness to answer.

---

2) Dumb decisions, in as near chronological order as I can remember. Jacob, ghoul, retired for Ivan the Nosferatu. Who in turn was retired so I could come down to werewolf. Tony the Glasswalker, my first attempt at a werewolf character. Suicided attempting to leave a war pack. Billy the Virtual Adept, retired as it took entirely too much caffeine to get into that character. Noson the blind Bonegnawer, taken out like a punk when traveling through the Dreaming with his pack, trying to rescue a lost pack mate. Vincent the Boggan, the first one eaten by a dragon in the Dreaming. Never saw that one coming. Andre the Euthanatos spiraled quickly out of control, as most psychos do without someone to slam on the brakes. Convinced to suicide. Which brings me to Lies, who was shoved down the spiral when he (and I agree with you, this was foolish) attempted to start a shadow game.

As a note on this block of text. Yes, many of you PC's went down. But you have a fairly even split of characters that you decided to retire that did not die or suicide. With a couple of them it was merely a less then comprehensive understanding of the system of culture of the game. Others were just decidedly tragic luck. Ask other folk, if someone tests up 7 times on damage and your character tests down on soak. That is pretty much fin. It is not as rare a death as you might imagine. Part of the allure of character loss is HOW they are lost. Sure having a PC retire and live off his days elsewhere doing "stuff" can be nice. But having a character that dies and leaves an impact is so much more. Just ask Shetezle how he feels about loosing Noson.

3) A mouthy Galliard, you say? And became belligerent when not only the few people that had listened to him not take the warnings seriously, but he is told to his face by the leader of the group that they know how the story ends. It ends with Lies captured and tortured. I would have lost the character then if I hadn't convinced a few people to form a pack. And as for not following orders, when a ST pulls you to the side and says "sometime during the week. . ." how can you argue? I'd have to eventually go back to the area, to reclaim my belongings if nothing else. Am I supposed to say "sorry bub, I don't want to do a damn thing, and I'd rather sit here like a lump of fur."

To my trained eye this looks like a giant excuse. But in fairness if you had the perception that you had no options and had to do EVERYTHING yourself I can understand the actions. But that should not be the end all be all. If you are stuck and people are not helping you out try different approaches. If kindly asking fails, and belligerent falls apart, do not just stop and say well since those did not work I guess no one will help me. Additionally, if your character loses gear, fetishes, magic items, etc in the field and you are going to get captured or die if you try and get them back...cut your losses. OR convince others that they are family heirlooms and get a group together.

4) Again, shoved, but the end results are the same. The traps that I set up wouldn't have broken anything as long as the other characters acted smartly. I only told the BSDs the same holes in the defenses that I pointed out to Wilhelm, which was, in turn, promptly ignored. And how I was the only thing that set off Lew's alarm is beyond me.

I will address this only because it is specific. You fell to the wyrm, played with the sabbat, joined the technocracy, etc. Does not matter that you did it, in fact good job not getting killed on the doorstep. But the problem is that you got caught. It matters not how you got caught, if you get caught doing a no no in World of Darkness you are done. The chances of coming back from something like that are maybe 1/100.

And the finale. I put together a Shadowlord Galliard in the attempt to change my behavior and head space. And I fully recognize that it takes two to tango. As for wandering off, I smoke. Tough. Also, one needs to do thing to gain renown, and therefor rank. My attempts to get the pack to do things ended in ridicule or refusal. If I don't catch up with the rest of you, I feel that I'll just keep being left behind.

Your "running off" has nothing to do with smoking. You just could not be found at times because you were off solo in a scene. Additionally Shadow Lords are not the most collaborative concepts. They trend towards private actions and activities. Regardless of you Galliard Auspice you were just a Storyteller that likely knew tales others were too weak to deal with. Your pack bucked you because you tried to make a power play and failed. You, the player, presumed superiority and lost because other people were playing their characters and sheets. Rough. Game requires a separation of IC and OOC feelings. If you feel you are being ignored try and determine why the other people's CHARACTERS are doing so before you taken it personally.

Thank you for your constructive criticism. I would have preferred to have this debate face to face, but I suppose that rants fit the scheme well enough.

Again to reiterate, my words are not intended to anything but help. So my apologies if you felt stung at all.

I'm going to do my best to forget this character's story, and I honestly hope that I haven't stepped on too many toes in this latest failed social experiment.

NOTHING has failed you. The character's death does not mean what you did was wrong. It simply means that the way the cards played you ended with too many low rolls and bad draws. You can improve on what you started. I know you are playing a Nos right now and that is an AWESOME clan for group work. They one of the closest things to a supportive group built in. I would HIGHLY suggest getting together with them and talking about how your character can help. No just what you are good at or what you designed him to be. BUT what the clan needs as a whole. You may start to go in a different direction that you started but by working with them and building a story as a group you build your own as well. And if something bothers you, talk to them OOC. I know that it can be hard when presented with certain conditions but the only way to get wet is to either walk in the rain yourself or get tossed in the lake. And I promise on is preferable to the other.

Best of Luck.

-Josh

[AST Chris]

I should let you know that, as someone who is playing a member of the Torchbearers, Nosons death had a huge impact. The big push to create talens and fetishes came out of Wilhelms desire to not have what happened to Noson wouldn't happen again. He tossed down three of the anti-arrow talens on the way in.

That means Noson had a huge impact. I hate that it feels like Nosons death was meaningless, but if there are people actively doing things that were the direct result of what happened, there was an impact. Nate, you did damn well with your character, because the bell that tolled for Noson is still ringing.

[Nate]

Add Samson to that list.

Thank you, deeply thank you, for those that helped and held my hand and showed emotion and showed me feeling.

The rest of you, good bye.

I won't be playing another werewolf. My heart can't take another wound like this.